Remember the last time a major feature was introduced in Traktor Pro? No, unlocking Remix Deck support for all controllers doesn’t count. Neither does having a mapping window that expands when you drag the corner. Berlin’s Native Instruments has stayed relatively quiet while Serato DJ and a number of other smaller softwares have been in the limelight.
UPDATE: The Kontrol S8 has been announced officially – read our full analysis in this new article.
WANT TO GET A KONTROL S8? Sign up here to get an email as soon as the product is available for preorder.
The silence is slowly starting to show cracks – with a second video just uploaded in the “Future of DJing” series, this time featuring techno duo Pan-Pot. Watch below (or watch the first one with MK here):
Here’s what we suspect: Native Instruments is very carefully only showing us half of these “Future of DJing” interviews. In the other half, they’ve shown the artists a first look at an upcoming product or hardware that takes Traktor’s live remixing capabilities to a new level.
Notice also who these interviews are with – producer/DJs who heavily edit tracks and layer additional sounds on top of their DJ sets using the Remix Decks. These are likely the ideal users for whatever is coming next…
WHAT ABOUT A KONTROL S8?
We wanted to include a bit of speculative discussion that’s been going on in the DJTT forums about a new Native Instruments hardware or software release. Forum member Fango Jett posted this screenshot from a dutch DJ store:
Roughly translated, the interesting part is this:
“There is already some news about the courses for October 2014
Leon (traktor-instructor) comes to visit us 3 times:
– Traktor S8 and NEW SOFTWARE
– Machine Studio
– Komplete 10 and several new keyboards and some new software”
But does a Kontrol S8 even make sense? Would it have controls for eight different decks? That might seem excessive, but perhaps if the other decks are focused on live remixing or F1-like abilities (maybe even with a bridge to Maschine), it starts to make a bit more sense.
The other idea that jumps to mind is that Native Instruments could have a DDJ-SZ-style controller that has two soundcards integrated into it – meaning that if both DJs are plugged in at the same time, there’s four decks coming from each DJ – giving you eight decks total.
We’ll leave you with one more bit of speculation about the Traktor Kontrol S8 from forum member Ash Carr:
I think NI are going to move a little further from traditional DJing. I’m predicting that Traktor’s next upgrade will only advance the remix decks further and hopefully incorporate a step sequencer. When you look at the midi fighter twister and the digital warrior you can imagine that it wouldn’t take a genius at NI to think “hey, lets just put that into the next version of Traktor” and call it a Maschine deck or something.
With regards to hardware, you’d want something like a Livid Cntrlr to take full advantage of this new feature, but you’ll still need something that’s going to move your tracks around for normal decks. So they bang on some touch strips and get rid of jogs completely.
Thats my prediction.[…] Both this video and the one with MK kinda re-enforce my point that NI will be pushing the remix decks and getting rid of jog wheels in the next iteration of Traktor and there hardware. I think we are heading for a unit with two X1 mkII sections, Two F1 sections, screens and a beefy 4 channel mixer section.The clues are out there guys.
EDITOR’S UPDATE: KONTROL S-SERIES
We’ve seen at least one of the items on the list come true – the new Komplete S-Series keyboards and a brand new version of Komplete 10 (all available in the DJTT webstore Production Gear category here).
Read the full speculation and latest updates on the rumors about new Traktor gear and a potential Kontrol S8 DJ controller here in the forums.
2 Turntables,an Analog Mixer,an X1 and a F1 are ‘Thee’ Perfect set up imo.-having them all stuck in one box,while cool with the screens and less stuff to connect.,remember that if ANYTHING breaks,you cant do ANYTHING-
Still,very cool technology-…closer indeed.
why is dj techtools forum censor bad reviews of s8???
[…] of the format. Interestingly the format uses 8 tracks too, which fits with our idea of 8 track. Reviews sound interesting […]
[…] We’ll continue to have some of the best coverage of the Kontrol S8 in the coming weeks as it approaches a release date. Check out some of the original speculation about the product in this article where one of our forum members predicts the …! […]
[…] We’ll continue to have some of the best coverage of the Kontrol S8 in the coming weeks as it approaches a release date. Check out some of the original speculation about the product in this article where one of our forum members predicts the …! […]
The divide between Producer and DJ is growing smaller and smaller. DJ’s simply want more creativity and producers with little DJ experience need the gear to keep things simple and accessible. The comment “DJs simply don’t want to do much in the way of live remixing” is a statement made by a DJ with little or no interest in producing. Those DJ’s that do feel the need to be more creative are looking towards Native Instruments Traktor to do more than just play songs. Native Instruments is leaving the old analog ideals in the past and instead catering to the future generation of Producers, DJs, and Sound Designers with digital technology and advancements. Its the old school DJs that are left playing catch-up and undoubtedly feeling abandoned.
[…] We’ll continue to have some of the best coverage of the Kontrol S8 in the coming weeks as it approaches a release date. Check out some of the original speculation about the product in this article where one of our forum members predicts the …! […]
DJTT you freaking nailed it in you mock-up, maybe you always knew and had inside info?
Nope, no inside information – just a solid guess based on the Maschine Studio and Kontrol X1 MK2 updates..
The S8 does look surprisingly close to your mock-up
Thanks! I was pretty proud of it.
I still love jogwheels. Touchstrips: Not so much.
[…] Aphex Twin’s book and is purposefully teasing us; or someone just got really creative with photoshop like DJ Tech Tools has in the past and decided to mess with the internet. I don’t know; but, I do think […]
very close depiction of the S8 there – good work! 😉
the answer is -> http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B00N1YQMAE/ref=redir_mdp_mobile/191-5972166-6541914#
[…] http://www.djtechtools.com/2014/07/31/traktors-future-live-remixing-and-kontrol-s8/ […]
I’m not jumping to conclusions yet, but since I consider myself to be one one the “Lazy, unoriginal mediaplayer dj’s” (this is what you are, if according to some, you only play music without doing remixes) and IF Traktor is indeed aiming towards to “more creative” dj’s; I’m switching over to Serato. In my opinion, the people I play for, want recognisible music, so they can sing along, dance along to the music they know. They don’t care for a live on stage remix which, in most cases isn’t up to par with the Original.
Yeah..the one thing heldback in Maschine is all that audio file playback glory that a single Traktor deck can do..we all know that if NI introduced a plug-in in Maschine that allowed you to drop a clip in a slot or slots that Sync’d to the Master playback tempo it would be killer….Remix decks in Traktor came with features not in Ableton Live like DVS triggered movement and etc..but there’s no option for VSTs in Traktor…people are using both so what if Traktor opened up plug-in support bringing in Maschine to one software. Seems not hard at all and it definately would move heads off Ableton Live because you wouldn’t need to work on Sync’ing two softwares and running multiple cards..aggregated options are also there too..it makes sense and could open up alot of minds. The Bridge tried this but it’s currently down.
Actually, it sounds like they are talking about a version of Traktor that is more live performance-based than DJ. like the Remix decks didn’t bring that?
I’ve talked to with a good old friend. He is working for a company that build display’s and guess what? He said that NI ordered 1500 units for a product called Traktor. I said no way… but he said they are selling the displays for the Maschine as well… so I would say there is coming something big 😉
This is kinda scary from NI. I am afraid Traktor is going to turn into a Remix decks oriented business. This is a list of suggested features that I’ve gathered from the people I know who use Traktor:
(in no particular order)
– Bigger VU Metering
– Intelligent/Elastic BeatGrids (for those old tracks)
– BPM analyser for external source (to use FX for DVS users and even sync?)
– More stability/ease of use with club equipment (usually pioneer)
– a preparation mode to quickly cue up and check beatgrids with new imported tracks
While this list may only scratch the surface, this is how I could relate to it:
I bought Traktor because it had a more complete set of features a the right price for people like me, who likes to use midi and integrate it with djing. Is Traktor still that leader now?
I tried Serato and it felt a bit more goal orientated, a faster workflow, but still missing loop knobs and beatjump (when I tried it). However Serato is catching up with its new features and modular controllers, and with the updated SLs, it is also turning into a cheap option to start DVS.
Native Instruments, Remix decks are interesting but do not forget who buys your controllers and makes money using your software. I’m sure even Remix decks users want to make sure their stuff is rock solid live and doesn’t just look look like a pale attempt to make djing closer to clip launching.
Remember when you made the first X1? It was so good it felt almost crowd-sourced.
Oh NI hear us
(sorry for the big paragraph)
I’m in for a modular system, like Behringer did, just a bit nicer. Sometimes I want two decks, sometimes four. My biggest annoyance with the S4 is having to switch to C+D decks when they should have their own dedicated buttons etc.
I see it more like this: a new controller with LCD screens.
I’m not sure why no-one has gone down the path of a modular system. Just about everyone comments that they have their “own” setup that suits their style so why not endorse that. Apple and other big brands have realised the attractiveness to many people of being able to customise – from wallpapers on phones to selling cases in just about every colour under the rainbow.. so come on NI – be the market leader!
Firstly, I should say I am no tech… heck I am flat out midi-mapping but I know NI and heaps of people on this forum could probably work out how to do what I am suggesting.
What I mean is have a “central” mixer/controller (preferably with stand-alone mixer functionality) and then off add-ons. Make it so that you can start with just the mixer/controller so, if that’s all you need, that’s all you get.
If a DJ wants a CDJ-style interface, buy that and connect it. If you want sample pads, buy that and connect – hell you could literally have a “maschine” module for those that want it. They could even do a DVS with a traditional turntable and have “old-style” audio routed in.
My MC-6000 lets me have various audio sources as well as midi and remember Traktor already has “live” decks so it can’t be that complicated.
For clubs, you could include a “multi-dj” add-on including a soundcard with 2 soundcards so that a dj can easily take over. Surely there has to be some way that you could have the cdj module set so that you can include a USB thumb-drive or SD card and play off that. I mean we have HID and USB 3 now so surely data transfer is not that big an issue. This would also be a great back-up if you could flick a switch and have the audio from a USB stick, CD, SD card go straight to the mixer module.. very quick way of keeping the party going if the laptop crashes (and what I do because my set-up allows me to)…
If you wanted to, you could have a “screen” module etc… the list goes on.
The thing is, Pioneer have deliberately worked on a range starting from cheap (in pioneer standards) and working up so that people starting out; or who just need a simple set-up, can get used to their gear so it becomes their “go-to”. Why can’t NI do that.. it would allow people to have 1 set up that they can tweak as their styles change and, you never, know if the build quality was right you may see some clubs adopt it… because don’t forget 1 benefit for them of the “traditional” cdj & mixer setup is that if one part breaks, they can replace that part.. not the whole setup.
And work with a case manufacturer so that it can all “click” together and be easily transportable & safe no matter what options you choose.
Far-fetched – probably not because the original NS-7 had an effects controller you could add if you needed it. It really can’t be that hard.
Personally, I love trying the remix decks etc but I don’t use it in my sets as anything more than a boring old sampler… but it is fun to “play” with and see what I can come up with – it could just be that I haven’t really got my head around it yet.
BTW – To the NI rep who reads this.. shoot me the 1st one and I will gladly test it for you! LOL Actually, it’s my idea so just send me the full set-up when it’s ready!
What about native instruments freaking finally restore the sync between iphone and mac (i mean the metadata sync between tdj and tracktor). I don’t care that much with new features. The thing that the people is waiting for is usability. If they still want to sell more toys (f1, x1, etc… ) they will have to make it only for the new djs because most of the djs that works in a regular basis already have that kind of things. Look it from the user perspective… i already have a x1 … the only thing that is different in the x1 mk2 is that touch stripe… should i pay 200€ for that stripe when you can do exactly the same with a rotary knob? i don’t think so… They are pushing more the market of the hardware and forgeting that they are nr 1 on dj equipment for midi controllers only and only because of the users… users are already happy with the software and hardware but they are so concentrated in selling hardware that forgot about the software.
1. In my special case i bought the tdj for iphone only to make the cue points on the go while i was away of my computer. At the beginning it worked great but then the ios 7 came and until now no update or correction of the problem…
2. they said in pioneer or in native that you have the posibility to only plug and play with the cdjs 2000 and your laptop… i’ve been trying to do it since a long time and until now i can’t figure it out. (in between anyone knows here how to do it? )
3. when you are in a club, with relative little space and you are taking after another dj using different equipment as you… PAIN IN THE ASS to make the whole controller change and i’m not only talking about that but about the whole weight of controller, computer, etc… come on , make our life easier native!
Easy one to guess. They sell 90% of their stuff to bedroom dj’s. They have a “gaming” business model. For mist customers this is a passtime, or game if you want.
Making an S8 with “multiplayer mode” would be really smart. People start to reach out and meet to play with eachother (and comeptiteveness starts). This way engaging their public longer and feeding a gearlust frenzie to have a better setup than your friends.
“The media is not the message!”
This. I’ve never understood the entire “you’re not dedicated if you’ve never learned to beatmatch…” rule. Beatmatching is a necessity brought about by the physical medium – two mechanical platters not initially spinning at the same exact speed. Isn’t the true measuring stick the ability to effectively control physical energy via sound waves to invoke different emotions and reactions in human beings? So, it’s not about the music really, it’s about an individual’s skill in manipulating the delivery method. Kinda narcissistic in a sense. If the delivery method had always been digital, the criteria would likely be the ability to reimagine the sound, not manually lining up downbeats on two rotating wheels. No disrespect intended.
I love how NI integrates all three of their main products: Traktor, Komplete and Maschine. I only see good things happening as they all become more and more inter-compatible and easily set up that way.
“Live remixing”: Way, way, way too overrated.
does anyone know what kind of mixer pan pot uses in this video?
nevermind its a xone 92
The #FutureofDjing is in one’s ability to be as creative as possible using TWO TURNABLES A Mixer + A MIC. Finger drumming & programming to me no longer qualifies as DJing – performing perhaps, but NOT DJING !!! I’m going to add to it that as a typical Hip-Hop DJ who uses the aforementioned 2 Technics + a Traktor Z2 & and MIC…Native Instruments haven’t DONE ZILCH to appeal to the Hip-Hop & Scratch DJs: From their lack of “Hip Hop centric OR Reggae Centric” control vinyls to their obvious attempt at redefining DJing as a “PUSH BUTTON” sport LOL ….I want a DJ Premier or Bob Marley Edition control vinyl once in a while darn it !!!
You are right. For DJs observed in the wild, Traktor has always appealed more to the EDM crowd while Serato is kinda the hiphop choice. The hiphop/reggae/dancehall is a more traditional approach to DJing in a classic just beatmatch and scratch sort of way. EDM has this aura of constantly evolving making music sound more futuristic hence the need to do all this live remixing.
I see traktor beign more versatile than Serato… Traktor can do what Serato do but Serato cannot do what can Traktor do. So I prefer to have a tool available and choose not to use it than not having anything at all.
thats hardly what i would call the future! turntrables are the future? i dont think so. its great to be creative with less, but its also great to be creative with more. i dont hink it really matters what you label it as, the music industry has changed, all music is available to everyone now, you need to do more to stand out. thats the future, otherwise youl just fade into the past
Noxxi I’m all for moving a gazillion years forward, but I doubt your hardcore “steak-n-potatoes” mobile DJ has ANY interest in all this button mashing/pushing – or controllerism experiments. Try pulling some of that at someone’s wedding and see how quickly your clientèle shrinks. These features are GREAT for your home studio environment or production needs, but that doesn’t always translate well into LIVE DJing. Most traktor DJs I know don’t even use REMIX decks…they say it causes CPU spikes LOL so go figure!
hmm, ive never noticed that the remix decks cause cpu spikes, but then traktor was being weird with me recently. i decided to use traktor on its own partition to sort ths out. i seemed to work. it could have been the remix decks, ill investigat this further.
yeah you are totally right about that, but then you could say the same about turntablism. to be honest, most mobile dj’s ive come across so far dont use traktor, its usually a harware solution, like a numark all in one media player. sometimes virtual dj. Mobile dj’s are probably best left out of this, since for the most part they dont even bother mixing. a mobile dj will likely use no features of traktor serato or vdj. i think they suck because of that, they might as well just use windows media player, not all, but most. although i do see where they fit into the market and thats a part of the market im not willing to occupy so they are needed.
i know a lot of people dont use the remix decks, but they could, and thats the key thing to take away, is that they could. they have the choice. everyone has the choice to either sit on their laurels or try something different. i sit somewhere in between the two camps. and that works for me. i beleive that stuff like the remix decks are the future. the choice to do something differently is the future of djing. thats my opinion anyway
Future of DJing is to be as creative as possible only with turntables, a mixer and a mic? Why those particular pieces of equipment? Why not two tapes like it all started? Because turntables have been used for so long by so many people? Turntables weren’t even meant for DJing, nor were laptops, but that sure changed and will keep on changing. Aspiring DJs will keep on pushing the boundaries just like they started scratching and just like they started remixing songs on the fly.
I’m calling NI out and making a guess based upon everything I have read here including most of the comments. I think this S8 could be NI’s own competitor for the Pioneer DDJ-SX and possibly DDJ-SZ. Imagine a similar setup to one of those however instead of performance pads you had proper remix deck control? That would be the ultimate Traktor controller for someone who utilizes all of this. It could possibly do away with the jog wheels however I don’t think so? I think they’ll have both jog wheels and a touch strip.
Please N.I. – All I want are bigger pads (x8) and bigger jogwheels!!!
IMO I think that NI need to do is get into the dj booth in clubs. They need to compete with pioneer not serato. Wahtever they release needs to be a mixer, not a controller. Like a z8 or z4 rather than s8. A mixer that sets them apart, with traktor integration ,4 decks, and 2 laptop connections, and new traktor version with maschine deck…
Whatever it is, mixer or controller, ill probably end up getting it.
That won’t work. What they need to do is not compete with Pioneer but work with Pioneer like they have in the past. They are not going to EVER replace Pioneer in deejays booths with a standalone mixer product. What they could do is work more closely with Pioneer and keep more people in the Traktor ecosystem that they are now losing to Rekordbox. Something happening more and more every day.
This would be a great time too because Pioneer seems to have severed their ties with Mixvibes.
Latest version of Rekordbox has 2 channel mixing. I’m pretty sure Pioneer want to make their own software. seems to me like NI has become the Apple of the music/dj industry.. they want to make integrated software and hardware. not too many new 3rd party controllers or mixers offer native traktor support. I don’t see Pioneer and NI teaming up.
Actually havent any of you guys used traktor with the Pioneer CD decks? When you set them up as a controller for traktor and add a NI controller with pads and knobs its legit. And Traktor’s MIDI setup is so easy and versatile that you can mix with anything that transmits MIDI. But Pioneer makes high end gear that is more solid and rugged and meant to be a permanent fixture in the club. NI has always been a company that sells “High Quality” packaged and priced for a “Tight Budget”.
I have seen a few of my hip hop/serato dj friends using the Z2 at events recently. A Z4 would be perfect especially since people can still connect their sera to boxes to them
yes, exactly, what i forgot to mention, is that i still like to use turntables. a mixer (versus a controller) can hook up all existing gear in clubs.
when doing parties with friends, i bring out my Z2 so they can patch serato in. it makes the change over that much easier than my audio 10.
You’re thinking along similar lines to myself. I’d prefer, however, an NI take on the Allen & Heath Xone:92 rather than a Pioneer mixer. Here’s what I’m thinking:
6 channels (with the software expanded to include two dedicated slots for VST instruments (Two instances of Maschine in my case but options = awesome!)
Aux send/returns to add hardware FX
2 fully analogue VCF filters.
Also, VST FX hosting wouldn’t go amiss either.
It’d be another flagship model not aimed at everybody (many hip-hop DJs would find it almost useless), but here in London (and over in Berlin at a guess) the techno DJs would be all over it if NI can pull of similar sound quality to A&H. If it WERE going to happen. I’d guess it’d be part of a paid upgrade to Traktor 3.0 (much like the Maschine 2.0 upgrade.
I always have the latest traktor version but i still use traktor 1.27! All the new features do nothing important to my work as paid dj. All thes remix things are fun but have nothing to do with real life djing. Tje growd wants to hear what they know. They dont want to hear remixes drenched in thouasand effects. They dont care about it if the dj uses 10 controllers. “the futere of djing” is a slogan to sell things . The real future of djing is djing! Plas the right song at the right time just like it always was. There are many improvements that would be good for traktor to make the workflow better. But they are not fancy and they would not sell new controllers..
less is more
I would suspect and hope NI is coming out with something really new but not necessary big.
NI is not there for traditional ways of dj’ing… there’s Pioneer for that.
this seems A very Techno-biased way to think in terms software & hardware if NI heads this way it is no way mainstream tool For working DJs, but if you want this already, I’m sure Ritchie Hawton already did something like already with livid, I know MK apparently supports this aswell but is this DJing?
actually techno will probably outlast most other genres of electronic music in terms of whats in fashion or not. but thats not the point, it could easily be used to create any genre, just as easily as techno, techno is not special in this case. I suppose you are right when you say “is this djing?” but if you think about it, it doesnt matter, its a good bridge between production and djing, with a laptop in front of you and sync/beatgrids. its a little boring and lazy just to mix 2 tracks together, you can potentially do so much more than that, NI are trying to fill this void.
By the way, and please try not to be offended here as i mean it in a helpful way. but you should drop the “pioneer” bit from your name. its super lame, and the piopro on your pic is also really lame and sad. since a lot of people use pioneer anyway, its not really a unique thing about your self. and it also says to the world that you only have eyes for pioneer, giving the impression that your opinion on anything non-pioneer is not worth listening to, it also makes you appear to be a fanboy, so that makes your opinion on pioneer sort of rubbish too. its like if i had an iphone and called my self “iphone noxxi” you would be like “so what, everyones got an iphone”
sorry man, i really dont mean to offend or be a dick, but i think you would appear more credible if you dropped out that part of your identity
well failed miserably an assumption based on a PHOTO??? XD I’ve Worked as DJ for 14 years, “pioneer” was given to a nick name given to me from people who new where I worked in a store called “co-operative pioneer”, when I started DJing aka “DJ pioneer” back in 2000, But i used turntables, Pioneers are overpriced Shit!e!! and as for FanBoy fuck off, am PC not MAC or PIONEER, VCI-400,and a midi fighter with turntables is my gear &,touch osc as a fuck about and have always created my own mapping for traktor which is the latest version I also use Live with reason in production projects, now BACK TO THE CONVERSATION YA’ PRICK!!!
as I started DJing it was about the Tunes not just gear where as now the focus is on to much production in a live setting this is not commercially viable and in most venues i have played in and it’s not traditional in the scene of djing this is more a production tool and I can see this used in true underground club for sure in house & techno but is not DJing…
I dont actually recall saying that fife was the epicenter of techno but whatever.
I was just saying, no need to go apeshit about it, you dont need to explain yourself to me, if it were me i would want to appear to others as a serious dj, not like some young gun who is obsessed with pioneer. and not to bust your chops more, but there is already a dj pioneer…
I think james burkill is a perfectly decent stage name on its own btw. and if all that is true, how do you explain the piopro in your picture eh? hmm…
anyway “ACTUALLY”, i get what you are saying, but djing is changing, with the availability of music being as it is now and there being djs everywhere, it is increasingly important to cut your own sound. if you want to stand out that is. using generic names, generic tracks and generically mixing 2 tracks isnt enough to get peoples attention anymore. traktors remix decks are not more of a production tool as they are impractical for production, they are a performance tool, and djing is about performance.
it is no less real djing than when turntablists called cdj djs fake. what do you mean it is not commercially viable? for NI or for the user? NI seem to find it quite viable, and if you mean the user, then i disagree, spending time to create your sets and organising loops so that you sound amazing is part of being a DJ.
it sounds to me that you would rather just mix 2 tracks at a time, want to get paid for every single second you spend working on your set and if you dont get paid for it, then you dont bother.
that sir, doesnt make you a real DJ, that means you are simply cashing in, lazily playing a few tracks using the same standard mixing technique you always use and calling others “not real dj’s” for trying to do something more. YA PRICK!!!
live production performane is not djing….
i totally agree with you on the showboating aspect, like steve aoki and that, it doesn’t strike me as classy or professional. the music should always take center stage.
I also get what you are saying about it being like jamming, it puts me in mind of jazz music. i guess its a different act. i personally find ableton djing a little cold and uninspiring, i guess its important not to use the remix decks too much in that sense, they dont really offer enough sound sculpting to use that way for a full set anyway, the lack of a compressor springs to mind, as well as the cramped control of the actual F1 itself, i really never use the layered functions on it because its a pain to try to think of how to incorporate them, like reverse and even monitoring. but i do think they are most powerful when 1 is used as a drum loop kit, and another is used to launch samples. i sometimes just freestyle for a bit that way between tracks, it lets me add something unique to my sets. something that i can say is really mine.
one of the first artists using the remix decks for a native instruments video was dub fx, definitely not techno. many tech house, deep house and nu-disco dj’s are using them with motown and funk samples too, but more than any other genre techno has been encouraged to be live and about being in the moment. this is the one thing that ritchie had taught us all 20 years ago… techno is an expression of yourself at that moment in time. it was the reason why you saw a huge migration of techno djs with live 4 and 5 and why you have seen a large migration to traktor since 2.5.
firstly; I’m not attacking techno, it just seem to be a tool that is more focused on that sound, could be tech-house for all I care, but the point is that how many people will really use this in a live (playing out) environment this is very much shrinking their market, and its .not a traditional DJing tool, when I club I want to hear DJ sets tune secltion that take you an a not a collection of random Beats
just following on from the massive speil i left you in another comment, but i use both when im out, i play house and techno, some electro, a bit of drum and bass, garage, whatever i feel like that night. i use the remix decks when i feel like it between songs. thats how i make my set unique, its also excellent for adding drums to liven up a mix. its not a collection of random beats, its music and i think its great that i have these options
The only thing I would add is that Maschine really is a LOT better at managing everything the Remix Decks do. I think a lot of people don’t use Maschine (with Traktor… or any other DJ program) is because it can be moderately difficult to integrate and it is a lot more “industrial strength” to learn. What you get for using Maschine is a lush world of options, with more expression, more options for drums, synths, patterns, live sample editing, drum rolls, effects, etc.
ive always wanted to get into maschine, but for me its how much it costs that makes me sick. i know its worth that, but to drop the money for a maschine studio, i feel like i would be getting ripped off compared to getting ableton push. but then ive never used either.
I have a Mikro Mk2 (which I picked up new for $350). With a Mikro, you have full access to everything in Maschine, but I want to upgrade to the (middle of the class) Maschine Mk2, mainly because the knobs are right on the console for sample editing. The Ableton Push has more buttons, but they’re smaller. Either way, it’s all about personal choice… I endorse exploration for the purpose of betterment.
yeah totally man, its not what you have, its what you do. for me, if i was going to get a maschine, it absolutely MUST be a studio, it would bother me all the time knowing that i was maybe missing out. probably why im going for a push, since i already have ableton. but your right, it is about personal choice, both have their strengths and weaknesses, but who knows, traktor pro 3 might be just around the corner! that might change my mind yet again!
I recommend this for everyone: when you buy something, always buy what works for you now, with an eye to the future, and make sure it works with how you do things (both physically and mentally).
absolutely, it hink the line here is, “cut your own path” and “never stop pushing yourself”
Yes,They miss the more pop/house oriented scene I think. All those features become a little to complicated for al lot of mainstream dj’s.
Hopefully they do more integration with the Ipad. If you ask me the real future of live performance is Elektron gear and similar self contained units. If an Octarack had better Track to Track Dj capabilities and a user friendly Browser it would be murdering the competition right now.
I for one think it’s great to see NI pushing digital DJing forward in this way. I agree many djs will run a mile but performance is such a huge part of set that if used right this will blow peoples minds (especially if incorporated with the basics of DJing, such as playing for the crowd etc) I currently use an s4 with f1 and have both the x1 & z1 and the more other DJs see the flexibility and endless possibilities the more I see DJs coming on board and asking me to explain how it works etc. As someone who teaches both courses of Traktor and ableton I find the argument that traktor is heading towards a more ableton work flow flawed traktor for me is trying to add the instant playability of ableton
Me thinks that the future of DJing is nothing more than something like a basic 8 channel mixer and 8 pairs of unconnected RCA’s and DJ’s will be expected to take whatever technology suits their style of performance best. Bands hqve been taking their own gear for eons and with DJing becoming more and more diverse, I think this will be the future.
S4 + F1x2 = S8 ?
If Traktor Pro 3 has native integration with Maschine, they already have my money :). I don’t need 8 decks, but I’d certainly welcome not having to use JackOSX each time I want to use my “enhanced playback style.” If Maschine becomes more like Ableton-meets-AfterEffects (noting that Traktor is the only leading DJ software that doesn’t have Video/DMX integration), then I can see no one touching Native Instruments for at least a couple years.
No one is saying everyone using Traktor has to use all 4 (and possibly 8) decks, but it’d be nice to be able to have more (audio and video) flexibility for those who do (please keep improving the Controller Manager, the last few improvements was definitely good progress). I certainly see programs like Deckadance 2, and Virtual DJ, including VST support. This is something missing for a top-of-the-line DJ program that focuses only on “playing back music.” Every other top-of-the-line DJ program has some means to play back video except Traktor Pro, and this may be important as a many DJs turn into VJs.
I really hope that the Maschine side of this “Future of DJing” includes functionality similar to the Ableton 9 feature to isolate, identify, and make editable, voices from a track (voice-isolation-stripping). Personally speaking, I find using the drum in the incoming track played similarly to the outgoing song’s beat makes for a seamless transition because I can “tween” (an animation term) the difference… but I do this using a drum machine (using previously sampled and arranged instruments).
To really impress me, Native Instruments would do the above voice-isolation-stripping and allowing the DJ to manipulate just that part. I would prefer to move the voice in 3D space, but any “alpha channeling” (to use a Photoshop term) to affect part of a track (EQ range) with effects would be very welcome. Also, improved tags with automation (as per Deckadance or TheOneDJ) would be helpful. This is something akin to setting markers for Traktor to playback a cue point at a relative time along the workspace.
The more I use Deckadance and theOneDJ, the more I’d like a lot of these features in Traktor… or if Traktor doesn’t include them soon, I’m saying I would be more prone to use other software for DJing (Maschine works just fine as a VST) if Traktor doesn’t compete in this area.
At the very minimum, I hope Traktor integrates VSTs in the coming upgrade.
i would by an S8 to replace my Korg Zero8. It’s nice to have 4 full decks because then you don’t have to muck about with a sampler to layer recurring textures back in, and then you need channels for ableton clip launching, drum machine, and hardware synth. NOBODY but Korg makes/made a firewire mixer that has 8 stereo channels and an xfader.
So the migration to serato is happening soon people?
If they carry on down this route they are appealing to a smaller and smaller crowd.
The F1 only appealed to a section of the DJ market and even then I think most people who bought one either ended up not using it or selling it on.
Most DJs simply don’t want to do much in the way of “live remixing”.
I gotta say I’m a bit worried about NI these days…
totally agree with you,something like this will only push more people towards serato.
honestly, i’m not seeing it. i’d rather be limited by what i can do and grow through practice, than limit myself by software/hardware. all these people complaining about the F1 deck, lots of people use them, if you don’t then don’t buy one… easy solution. for those of us that use maschine, it’s an easy platform for live loop playback for dubs or our own creations.
dont be silly! why would somebody say to themselves “hey, i hate the remix decks so much that instead of not using them, i will just go and buy serato, learn to use that instead and hate on traktor”?
you can simply not use them, its not like your forced into it, but you are given the choice, and choice is a wonderful thing. plus traktors timecode is superior to seratos anyway, and this comes from qubert himself, so theres no arguing with that. id rather have the best, with all of the tools at my disposal whether i use them or not, because one day i might feel like trying something different.
The DJs are now live musicians, you said “DJs simply don’t want to do much in the way of “live remixing”” then they will stay in the past where they only play a track and no more. The F1 challenges the creativity an live remixing is the future!
You talk like a very young bedroomer who never earned a single buck from djing. Real life is different.
and you talk like a very old hotel function dj, who has no desire to push their music or create a unique identity for themselves. Theres a reason Pan-Pot are famous, if you google eric flores you will find that he is already an accomplished and well known dj, where as nobody has heard of midiman. Real life is only different if you are lazy/dont care and only dj for money
Pan–Pot are who they are because they are AMAZING producers. Not because they “live remix”.
BTW they way they play now is fucking boring and they hardly do anything that could be considered ” live remixing”.
david guetta is famous if you ask someone who is pan pot on the street no one knows them. I am not famous either vut i make a living from djing since 15 years. If you are a pro you do it for mones. If you want to be famous and make millions write a hit like guetta. If you wanna be a freak in small niche of a niche genere and do it for fun you are not a pro but a hobby dj . If that is fine for you ok but i have to pay bills and i can. That does not mean i dont love music. If someone talks about live remixing they always talk about five names who do well for the rest of us ist just waste of time.
lmao… kinda funny, i was playin’ pan-pot trax before i had ever heard of david guetta.
So basically every DJ should just do the same thing? So if i am more creative then you and have a greater understanding of the equipment and want to put the time in so i can sell a superior product (even though probably only other top DJs will dig and respect what i do) then that would make me “a very young bedroomer who never earned a single buck from djing?” if thats the case then let me know what DJ text book i should check out from the library so I too can be a professional carbon copy DJ who nobody remembers the moment i stop spinning. 15 years in the game and you would think by now you would have realized that different formulas work for different DJs and at the end of the day the only thing that matters is the smiles from the crowd and the calls to your agent. Im glad playing it safe works for you and respect on your career but honestly real heads dont make it out to hear DJs who just play music.
I guess there are people who give up on their dreams and settle into the mediocrity of “this’ll do… no extra effort is required”, but that’s not something to be celebrated… it’s a consolation prize.
I hate to be the pessimist here but I think midiman is a little abrasive but ultimately right. I’d say a solid 90% of DJs now (being bedroom or professional) don’t use anymore than the controls provided by an S2. I like the idea of progression but NI has to consider the largest part of their market will never use anything more than they currently provide.
i agree, sadly that is true. but the option should at least be there for people who want to make their own way. these bedroom dj’s all want to be famous, thats only going to happen if they can create their own sound, and even then its a maybe.
I think its sad that so many djs here are saying that its pointless, and that in real life its not practical. yeah djing might be your job, but fuck me, we get paid enough money for it dont we? even the worst of us woudlnt struggle to pull in £20 an hour! i think we owe it to the listeneres and the guy paying our wages to be more.
anyone with traktor and a weeks training can mix a few tracks together, i dont think thats enough to qualify yourself as a DJ. atr least i dont beleive it gives you the right to go around calling yourself a dj, especially if you dont care or cant be bothered to bring something worthwhile to the table. in my town i actually have to compete with guys like this and it sickens me. i spend housrs, often days looking for new music, building drum sets, tweaking mappings, building remix sets, and listening back to my recordings. and i have to actually compete with guys that show up with virtual dj, chuck a few tracks on and barely even mix them, my biggest competitor doenst even bother to mix, he doesnt even hit the sync button, i mean he literally does not even slightly give a shit about mixing, he might as well use media player. but then he cant call himself a DJ.
If your in this line of work, you owe it to your listeners, your employer and yourself to be more. more importantly you owe it to other dj’s, if you want to pollute the DJ pool even further, giving us a bad name for a few bucks, then seriously you need to just get the hell out, your doing real dj’s a massive dis service.
btw that wasnt aimed at anyone in particular, it was really just me ranting.
Really, 20 years ago i quited mixing cause i wanted to produce tracks instead of playing tracks from others. With the digital dj mayhem around and all the looping (played on a Kontrol X, Z and F1 recentely) its much easier to integrate your own stuff in other music…But if you dont know in the beginning how to produce a track, than looping and stuff with your F1 will not sound that nice….I mean, you only can use a 3 banded eq….I heard a lot of mixes recently with traktor stuff and the most ” dj’s” who played with them made the set to much overcrowded in the lows and the mids…..So a dj is NOT a producer!!
thats absolutely not true, a DJ can totally be a producer, i cant believe you are even implying that they cant! and i also totally disagree with you saying it cant sound that nice either, remember you arent making synths and stuff on it, its all loops and samples, the loops and samples are made in a DAW, with all of the bells and whistles, they are taken into the remix decks for live arrangement. what your saying is that a dj mix wont sound good unless its made with a DAW, something we all know to be untrue. the remix decks are just the same as DJing, but with smaller parts of the mix.
what do you mean “with traktor stuff”? do you mean controllers? because its not traktor thats making it crowded in the lows, its shit DJs making it like that, you can make a song crowded in the lows and mids with any equipment.
i agree that if you dont know how to produce a track then using your own sounds isnt going to work, but thats a skill thing, it has nothing to do with traktor, and its something that a DJ should have some knowledge of anyway, a DJ has to understand the structure of music to actually be good, the skills are transferable, but it still takes talent. if you think you have the talent, then why not show it off? or do you think its better to leave that talent at home and do half assed mixing in the booth?
I guess my degree in music production (which I got before becoming a DJ) doesn’t count then?
a person, company, or country that makes, grows, or supplies goods or commodities for sale.
“an oil producer”
a person who introduces and plays recorded popular music on the radio.
“he was the only DJ to play our last release on the radio”
play recorded music on the radio or at a club or party.
“he DJ’ed for 5 hours nonstop”
When we see DJs like Hawtin and Luciano we see the live remixing importance, but if you see a DJ like Sven Vath you will see an old school good DJ. You choose what do you want: Old school with vinyls or the Future with live remixing and live sets. The media is not the message!
Is money how you measure a good DJ? Obviously if no one wants to pay or listen to a DJ, he’s presumably pretty bad, but I guess it depends how you see DJing. Is it a service? Is it an art? Art definitively isn’t measured with the amount cash it can produce. Also DJing for pleasure and DJing for money are two very different things. I DJ for a living too btw. And no I don’t consider myself and artist necessarily.
i almost consider myself a technician when it comes down to it, but with a creative flair, like maybe an architect of music or something! haha!
thats a pretty interesting point though, “is it a service? is it an art?”
i guess its both and neither at the same time, if it is a service then the skill is quantifiable and therefore relatable to money earned, if its an art then its totally subjective how much its worth
maybe its akin to a graphic designer, in that its a creative service.
Heh… I have one of those degrees too 🙂 I never really thought of myself as a graphic and music designer, but yeah… I guess I am.
thats a pretty cool skill reportoire! (spelled correctly?) my girlfriends studying to be a graphic designer, me an architect. i think for people like us (dj’s) its all about having a creative outlet, i seek that in a career, and a hobby, be it any sort of design. i get more satisfaction out of something if i know i worked hard at it.
Yeah, I think *other careers* don’t let you keep doing the same thing. You have to keep on pushing the envelope.
yeah, there are 2 types of minds, the mind of the creator and the consumer. id know what id rather be!
I don’t know who you’re thinking of MIDIman, but take a look at all of the world’s top DJs and tell me they aren’t live mixing many things at once. They are the Elite of Live-Producing DJs.
i think in this case, “real life” is actually a pseudonym for “dissapointing career”
Sorry dude this ones a little far out there.. show me a World “TOP DJ” not as voted by you, but as voted by media that does what you say they do. They don’t. Never will
The ones who arent even in the top 200 list? Yep they are probably pushing the boundaries.
i see it the same way as you paco loco… and i think there’s a lot of people, who’s changing back to cdj’s – even with the new rekordbox! i think they should work on their preparation mode or settings and an easy plug & play. i’m a traktor user since years, but i tested the new rekordbox and i’m impressed. just walk to the box with 2 usb sticks or sd cards… is so much easier sometimes. i hope they work on traktor 3 with stuff like that
i agree…that whole “live” remixing thing is so overrated! tell me, wich djs do that? its just loop over loop with the occasional hats,rides, etc on top, in what world is this live remixing?
i go to techno parties for a long time, and the only dj who comes close to this thing is speedy j…saw him using traktor and an octatrack live.
but tell me one dj who actually cuts pieces of music and rearranges it live? and i dont mean have loop over loop playing…there is none in the techno field who uses traktor.
Ummm Pan-Pot? Did you even watch the video??? Victor Calderone, Nicole Moudaber, and Richie Hawtin just to name a few others for you?
I think you missed the point of that post, Mark. b clearly said “I don’t mean having loop over loop playing”. Yes Victor, Nicole, and Pan Pot all just use synced tracks/loops on modular controllers but none of them really do all the much with it. I am a HUGE fan of Victor, Nicole, and Pan Pot as deejays and producers but I have taken time to actually watch what they do since they started playing this way over the last 2-3 years and they don’t really do much of anything impressive when it comes to the whole “live remix” thing.
Well the way he typed it doesn’t really say that. it was like two different thoughts. “there is none in the techno field who uses traktor.”
@mark smith : what i meant is, that nobody in the techno field who uses traktor cuts up pieces of music etc..
also because it cant be done (yet) looping parts and playing them on top of each other is not live remixing in my eyes, even if a maschine or push is played over it..
what would be nice is that if you can slice your loops live..rearrange it, then play parts..assign parts to control pads etc…that kind of stuff. this can be done with ableton…but its traktor videos that are talking about live remixing..and this is not the case as of yet.
Not as like as an Octave One set, but a lot more live then 2 CDJs and a mixer. with 3 decks, 8 cue points each and then 16 remix slots there’s a lot of jumping and dicing you can do. But really, go over board and your set is too ADD. I think the layering adds a much better flow. You can instantly increase the energy by just layering a clap on the down beat. The F1 allows you to al least do that without the complication of Ableton. If you want to do a full live set, yeah then use Ableton instead, which has it’s own drawbacks, like no library.
yes i know you have more options then with vinyl or cdjs..but jumping or cue juggling is not live remixing to me, and playing on occasional clap or ride etc on push or maschine aint remixing either.
and how is a traktor set more “live” then playing with vinyl or cdjs? i tend to find a set by jeff mills playing dynamic on three decks to have much more energy then that clap played over an otherwise dull beat.
Seriously, i couldnt disagree more. From the moment i got the S4, like when it first came out, before they had remix decks and all the other upgrades, I fell in love with it for one reason. I realized that all of the loop and cue functions allowed me to literally remix tracks on the fly. I would creatively loop a section of what was playing, build a mix with another track being looped in, combine that with fx and filters and then go to town with the cue points of a 3rd track doing finger drumming, chopping down vocals, creating on the fly builds and drops….Honestly, the sky is the limit with Traktor especially with the upgrades, new fx, flux mode, the sync button….Lol…well the rest of what i said i meant.
It’s really common i techno. Not just Speedy J. Leibing plays with Maschine, so does Drum Cell and Audio Injection. Obviously Pan Pot from the video. It’s really common in techno for guys now to just loop or jump around tracks and do a lot of layering.
It is way less common in house, though there are some. Luciano, Carl Craig and Reboot do this kind of thing a lot.
Bass kleph does a lot of live remixing.
To be fair, a lot of people don’t know that they CAN do something like this and it takes pioneers to show them the way, that path has only recently been cleared for people who don’t have thousands of dollars to throw at experimenting.
It takes a lot of time, money, and energy to become a good DJ and a lot of people get tired of the fight once they get to this point. Knowing that becoming a Producer takes even more money, effort, and time makes a lot of people stop pushing for more, and settle on the success they have…enjoying the fruits of their labors.
Becoming a Producer once you’ve become good enough to be a professional DJ seems even more daunting… having to learn a bunch of new skills, and having to be humble again, is not what a lot of DJs want to do (feeling they’ve already earned their right to respect). Also, there is still an attitude of “Producer superiority” in the music industry, so “going back down to being a DJ” is seen as a step down by most Producers.
Very few people keep on fighting for their original dreams; most people give into “what is” rather than “what could be” especially when very few people can tell how much harder a Live Producer-DJ works over just being a DJ. You have to really want it, deep-down inside. So… being a Producer-DJ is like being Spetznaz, you can quit at anytime, in order to remain being the best, you have to REALLY want it.
BTW, The really famous DJs like Oakenfold, Tiesto, Van Buren, Speedy J., Bass Kleph… they’re all Producer DJs… the Spetznaz.
It all depends on how serious you are about making a unique set. I find it awesome that so many people bought one then sold it, because now you can pick them um for super cheap (I bought mine for 100 bucks, new in box). At the end of the day though the people that can learn this tech and perfect using it in a live setting are going to be able to take sets to the next level. Yes it might be a specific crowd but Its a lot bigger crowd than the people that can afford to drop 3k on a pioneer setup.
i 100% agree with all of this! these days you have to do be a cut above your peers. theres no denying it, vinyl DJs are dying out almost everywhere, save for a few places. being able to rock your own material live is getting somewhere into production territory. if you are going to make it big then produciton is important.
Plus, I think “live remixing” is quite restricted on a few genres. In many others it seems rather impossible to keep up with industry standard productions throwing in some loops and stuff.
[…] materia?em zachwalaj?cym sprz?t produkowany przez NI. Co ciekawe, w sieci pojawi?y si? te? teorie spiskowe, mówi?ce o tym, i? seria ta ma za zadanie przygotowa? grunt pod nowe kontrolery i nast?pn? […]
Surely Native Instruments has something big planned, Serato and competing hardware manufacturers like Pioneer and Numark have leaped forward in their products and what’s the best NI has offered recently? Essentially what is a glorified multi-coloured S4? Seems they’re a little slow to step up to the plate but it’s obvious they can’t just keep releasing new versions of the same products. I think an S8 is on the way and I wonder if it’s an upmarket S4, like a DDJ-SZ – much bigger than an S4, maybe has screens? And I think the 8 is definitely referring to additional decks in terms of remix decks and the like.
I dream of an 8 channel traktor certified mixer so i can monitor each slot on my remix deck plus i can monitor my mchine in two channels adition to two track decks
And traktor pro needs a big upgrade so u dont need to include ableton live to your set for advanced integration with maschine
Could the S8 on the screenshot just be a typo?
[…] como siempre los foros de Djtechtools.com tienen algunas respuestas la mar de interesantes a partir de esta serie de videos. En concreto, un […]
Native Instruments is very carefully only showing us half of these “Future of DJing” interviews. In the other half, they’ve shown the artists a first look at an upcoming product or hardware that takes Traktor’s live remixing capabilities to a new level. http://qr.net/Fh7J
No they’re just ads for current products. There’s nothing new in there.
The step sequencer is just incorporated, watch carefully the lights on the left traktor f1 and you will see it
Could it be just a Maschine Micro?
That’s a Maschine. It has been around for years.
wow you have a good eye!
for eveyone else its at 1:37
Permission to call bullshit?
This is all speculation. Until you have some actual evidence I’m going to say S8 is a typo. One source equals no source.
Which is why the article used the phrase “speculative discussion”. They didn’t say it was anything but speculation.
Please, call bullshit as much as you like! We do think it’s an interesting rumor, but the S8 name seems a bit far of a reach.
I’m all for S8 as long as the size is not a factor, S6 is great but clunky to drag around. There’s something cool about adding features but thinking about ergonomics is also important. Now, in hindsight, I would have purchased small modules and hooked these together rather than a big controller such as S6. It’s similar to guitar amp combos versus head and cab, more flexibility when you split things up.
As for the future of DJ:ing, most producers know how to remix on the flight so one approach is to make it easy for middle and entry level DJs.
What do you mean S6? That’s not a thing yet, and if you are meaning S4 it isn’t that clunky or hard to move around not to mention a lot of DJs manage to fit It in most DJ booths so it’s size can’t be too big an issue.
Sorry S4. I have it on a bag but it’s big for many DJ booths. As mentioned, I would have gone a modular way if I would invest in something like this today, pieces for pick-and-choose per each gig.
Yeah thought that’s what you meant, just making sure, see I have different setup for different booths, if the booth has Turntables I have my Control vinyl, Laptop and Soundcard, if it has CDJs and a 850/900 mixer just my laptop or USBs and I normally have my Launchpad controlling effects and cuepoints inside Traktor so I can adjust myself to fit any DJ booth, always prepared for the worst outcome.
An S2 with an X1 would accomplish the same goals and not be as “clunky.” That’s my preferred setup if using a controller. Otherwise Z2 and CDJ’s 🙂
The S4 was a little chunky, but you could usually squeeze it into a booth (sometimes migrating a small bar table into a corner). It was a sad day when I sold it, but I find that a Z2 fits a bit better and i feel that it has a warmer sound. Although it’s a heavy beast and still takes up a fair bit of real estate in a smaller booth when you add an X1 and an F1. The most ideal situation is to have an A10 for when you go out, so you can use the hardware that’s there. It cuts down on weight carried, potential of damaged all-in-one gear and big cases.
I feel you on the modular route. I’d like to see them upgrade the Z2 mixer before adding another all-in-one. My experience with the all-in-ones is that they are simple and easy, but end up not having the same satisfying “feel” as modular setups. Purely a subjective preference, but that’s how’s I feels.
NI should integrate synths and a drummashine in Traktor Pro and maybe som taktile surface like Roland HandSonic
Wouldn’t that just make it like Ableton Live, except for a different workflow?
Shure but more in an all synced and easier setup för non-musicians more like an synth/drum-rack in Traktor main view with pitch & cue etc
It’d mean they’d integrate Maschine.