Stanton has carefully leaked news of a new controller through the most underground of sources, a guitar center flyer. They have then decided to put up a confidential website, containing additional sensitive information that was not mailed to 500k guitar center customers. Is this what passes for guerrilla marketing these days?
Its called “Dascratch?” and appears to be the love child of the pacemaker and a kaos pad. The point of this article is not to re-announce news that skratchworx and CDM have already covered but instead to talk about the concept of touch pad controllers- again.
Here is the problem- static touch surfaces get old fast. Ribbon controls and touch zones that do one thing and one thing only are just not interesting and will never replace a good knob, fader or button. Sure, an XY pad is good for FX and other performance applications but they are great as an accessory, not the only form of control. The lemur, a non-static touch surface which can be re-configured to suit any need instantly is exempt from this broad sweeping generalization.
throw in pressure sensitivity and interactive haptic feedback and I will sing a different tune but we are not even close to that goal. MidiMan tried in 2001 but abandoned their efforts. For a dj controller to properly take advantage of this new dimension in control, they are going to need to re-write the book not just re-package existing technology.
Trust me, touch sensitivity and interactive screen surfaces get me excited too but after testing the pacemaker for a month and trying every ribbon sensor under the sun I was not really that impressed. This is the kind of thing that could be incredible with a lot of R&D and the right design team- the Iphone for instance obviously nailed it. I am personally excited to see how well Stanton executes this design but If you don’t want to wait and see if it really “changes the dj world forever” then make your own!
Check out this video which gives us a much better look at the controller and shows some interesting features:
Hi, I just received the DaScratch for christmas, and I think this is a really cool device! Only touching a section to absolutely set it's value directly (what touchpads are about and stuff) is really handy. The different possibilities with the big section in the middle (You can divide it into knobs for juggling) and the way you can set and change them are well-engineered and easy to use. Also I think touchsliders are for some things a much more usable way to control stuff, for example pitching, setting volume ; for the main things you use sliders normally.
Yes, I want to say that touchsliders are generally easier to use than old mechanical sliders, especially when we think of cutting something with a slider. But for sure thats my subjective experience.
All in all I wanted to say that I think this article is unfair to this new (in my eyes -cool-) device. I for sure do not want that every new "special" midi controller coming out is getting praised immediately here in an article, but in the case of the DaScratch, I think this was not the right way to welcome it.
[quote comment=""]If multitouch qualifies as a "surface that you can put more than one finger on" than it is multitouch. %-)
Look at the demo video, the DJ [enter name here] changes all three EQ band at once, with three fingers.[/quote]
if its true multi touch- I.e tracking multiple points within the same field then they would run into patent issues- monome, apple.
this however has multiple zones which you can touch at the same time. Not exactly multi touch as far as I can tell.
If multitouch qualifies as a "surface that you can put more than one finger on" than it is multitouch. %-)
Look at the demo video, the DJ [enter name here] changes all three EQ band at once, with three fingers.
[quote comment=""]Seriously considering getting my hands on one of these devices, need more information though ! One of my biggest questions – is it multitouch?[/quote]
Great question- Stanton?
[quote comment="14255"]
stanton is known for ripping off customers. just check the long final scratch history. i am sure nem0nic will be able to acknowledge this.[/quote]
I think Stanton should get the chance to show us a new side but I am a little perplexed by the timing of this new controller. As far as I know the SC3 system is not even on the market yet, but now this one is getting rushed onto shelves first?
Seriously considering getting my hands on one of these devices, need more information though ! One of my biggest questions – is it multitouch?
[quote]My point is that Stanton has a history of stepping up and trying new things and people don’t appreciate that.[/quote]
*cough*
stanton is known for ripping off customers. just check the long final scratch history. i am sure nem0nic will be able to acknowledge this.
About friggen time someone started packing bomes midi translator in with hardware + 1 000 000 to Stanton for this one!!! *does a little dance* thats totally awesome news !
@DJ Tos: I strongly agree with the idea of having dedicated knobs for controls. Having a knob, button, fader, or jogwheel for everything you want to control makes it available to control as fast as you can move your hand there. You don't have to think about what mode the controller is in or set a mode before you use a control. I think that's the biggest reason I could never use a pacemaker — you absolutely have to press a mode button to get to every bit of functionality on the thing.
The only place in my rig where the controls aren't dedicated is in the fx. I use a rotary encoder to click through different FX and then have a touchpad control them in different ways.
It's a statement of how you interact. You interact with each effect in a unique way and most of us only use one effect on a channel at a time. So instead of having lots of dedicated controls for every effect you might use, just have one set of versatile controls that can be reconfigured to control every effect.
I think the 'dascratch' compares very closely to the interface of an EFX. You can use circle mode to control effects that demand smooth changes in a parameter, like the EFX's jet, and then use button mode to control beatmatched fx like echo or transform (trance gate) where the parameter should be rounded to even values.
@Anonymous: That does sound pricey, but the recommended price always does. The street price will probably be lower once its been on the market for a while. For example, guitar center lists trigger fingers at $149 while the recommended price is $249. The same for an MPC500 on zzounds, list at $599 with a recommended price of $1,349. You could probably get a better price than that for both of those items, but I used two major distributors as an example. I have no idea why this is pretty much standard practice in the industry, does this make sense to anyone else?
We are actually thinking about encrypting the presets, but only for the first month or so. The reason behind this is not because we want them to be kept secret. It's because we want to control the initial support process and "lock things in" a little bit. This makes it easy for us to track issues without worrying about what the user is doing with the presets.
But we aren't trying to lock them down to keep stuff hidden. I think you'll see that when you get a look at the presets, you'll find that they're all laid out in such a way that they TEACH you how to write presets. As an example, every preset has a "dead" translator that calls out all of the global presets and their functions. And we've also "over-qualified" our presets. On a given slider, a specific feedback mode will be used by default. But if you want to change that, the rules are already there – all you need to do is uncheck one rule and check another.
Stanton is committed to an open standard.
I'm pretty dubious about all-touch surfaces, but after watching a few of the videos circulating this is starting to look like a pretty cool companion controller.
It is really encouraging to see manufacturers thinking outside the square.
300 USD seem a little pricey though, having sat through many sales pitches from the various companies who make the chips to power this tech I know it very cheap and allows easy construction.
[quote comment="14172"]DaRouter is “Powered by Midi Translator”, which means you can use Bomes MIDI translator to edit your configuration files… +1 to StantOn.
[/quote]
Its very unlikely that you will be able to edit the files as they will most likely be encrypted. There is always the chance that they will open though- so heres to hoping!
DaRouter is “Powered by Midi Translator”, which means you can use Bomes MIDI translator to edit your configuration files… +1 to StantOn.
It would still be better-seeling as a: big usb-touchpad with 4 instant buttons; 4 click buttons; 6 modes and 2 scrolls(one absolute and one relative, LOL). Heeh, inovative it is. Still, having multiple "hardware" layers multiplied by number of decks multiplied by midiTtranslator power and all that multiplied with multiple multiplied units…you tend to forgot, that you are supposed to mix music.
I like the idea that one knob does one thing (ok not that stiff setup but, basically that).
[quote comment="14167"] the multitouch features and different modes of operation make this more flexible than a basic trackpad. I'm not a huge fan of Stanton products in general but for them to be putting out something this new at this price point is pretty cool.[/quote]
Now that we have had the chance to see more features in the video- I agree this looks like it may be more than a larger version of the pacemaker. Hopefully Dj TT will get one soon to test.
I agree with tobamai, Stanton is at least trying something new here. Based on the videos and the now "public" explanation available on their website, the multitouch features and different modes of operation make this more flexible than a basic trackpad. I'm not a huge fan of Stanton products in general but for them to be putting out something this new at this price point is pretty cool. I'm sure we'll see something much better from Rane or Korg eventually but probably at triple the price.
Another youtube vid by westendDJ
I really don't think touch strips should be compared to buttons and knobs – touch strips do things that knobs and faders do not and this is what makes them useful. With a fader or knob you cant lift up the knob, put it into a different position and start twisting from there – with touchstrips you can instantly skip to differnt sections in a way that is not possible with faders or know.
Now i am not saying that touch strips should replace faders and that they are better, its just that both devices have their pros and cons. Moldover gives great demonstrations on how a touchstrip can be used effectively in ways that no one could do with a knob fader.
I would love to see more touch strips on devices, along side faders and knobs !
here's an official video from stanton!
-doubleyou
[quote comment=""]the love child of the pacemaker and a kaos pad[/quote]OMG
BEST.
LINE.
EVER>
Hey guys, thanks for your commentary and thoughts. You always stir up great dialogue here. I hope people didn't think this was a negative article about the new Stanton idea. I am very excited to see what they come up with. It's impossible to judge this until it comes out, so instead I am pointing out that we hope it's more than a kaos pad. Stanton has been doing great things and their new system was one of the most innovative offerings at namm.
I just want to comment on something the poster above me said…
I think Numark has been the one doing the most "innovation," as compared to Stanton. Most of the stuff I see from Stanton has been fairly ordinary…but nobody even tried a CD turntable that actually worked somewhat like a turntable, or any of the stuff Numark does. They're the innovators in my eyes.
In response to this new Stanton item:
It looks interesting, and worth a play. I hope Guitar Center or Sam Ash has one hooked up in the display area soon so I can mess with it before I even ever think of buying it.
Stanton is catching a lot of flack for this release, what's that about? How can we applaud the aurora which isn't innovative in its controls at all (it's mixer controls and lots of fx parameter controls on one surface) and then turn around and rag on stanton? This control surface does offer features that are unique and innovative, it deserves to be applauded as well, if not more so.
I think part of the problem is what people think it does based on the name. Maybe the guys at Stanton thought digital djs would want to use this as a replacement deck, but that doesn't mean djs have to use it like that or that it should compete with turntables, vci-100's, otus, or even Stanton's own SCS.1d.
Look at how the beta tester in the scratchwerx footage is using it. It doesn't replace his mixer or his decks. It's small enough that he was able to sneak it in between there and uses it to control fx and loops. At $300 the price point is like pad controllers (m-audio trigger finger or korg padkontrol) that people are already using to control fx and loops. If you want to control lots of things from one surface, like loops and fx on four decks, then the led backdrop might be great to show you where parameters are set when you swap between channels. The only thing you can buy right now that's close to that is a lemur, a touch screen, or a kaoss pad (all of which have a more expensive street price than stanton is quoting as list price).
My point isn't that this is the best product announced all year, I'm not trying to sell anyone on it (that's stanton's job). This is another example, the thing is a very unique offering to the market and promises people more flexibility. My point is that Stanton has a history of stepping up and trying new things and people don't appreciate that.
I think how useful this item will actually be depends on how much control you can hack together yourself to do things it wasn't intended for. For example, if you can rebind the midi to make one of those touch faders do strip search, that's great! If you can change the output of the LEDs based on different software parameters, it'll be really useful.
(Ean, Tos, this isn't a rant pointed at you, it's just a respone to the poor reception da "dascratch" has received. It really belongs on scratchwerx, but the guys there would rather post insults as their analysis than legitimately criticize new gear)
I know you'll all say: "ToS is always like this" but i'd guess that this touch-c**p will finish in the gutter, the gutter of nonergonomics.
I really wonder if it is really really cheap, because it should be.
The design is bad, the ergnonomics are worse and it (unlike the pacemaker) only spews out midi? No OSC?
In my world/head: Control of "focused deck" is a simple way to make a really nasty error in the heat of the mix (which is usually the best part). Having a controller focusing the deck kills the logic that mate the controller. Are we "the digital DJs" so advanced that we don't need separate controls for each deck? I don't think this is the issue about who is advanced and who's not. Some things are a must, like learning to beatmatch before exploiting a software for that job. I expect OTUS to become a stadard MIDI unit in every serious club(ow and otus lacks rotating pitch-plate). Let the discussion begin.
Maybe little lightbulbs with feet will like this device…
I know it's still early and the jury is still out on this one but I agree with Ean in this case. I'll stop while I am ahead.